Minutes of the 60TH Meeting Og AEC Advisory Committee on Biology and Medicine January 16-19, 1957 (AEC-Acbm 60)

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The sixtieth meeting of the Advisory Committee on Biology and Medicine was held at Berkeley, Livermore and San Francisco, California on The meeting consisted of scientific presentations by the staff of the Donner and Crocker Laboratories of the University of California at Berkeley, the Livermore Laboratory at Livermore and the Radiological Laboratory of the University of California Medical Center in San Francisco, California. The Committee met in two sessions: one, devoted to the subject of the strontium-90 fallout problem which was held on the evening of January 16 at the Claremont Hotel in Berkeley and the second, held on Saturday, January 19 at the University of California Medical Center. The latter meeting was preceded by the Executive Session.

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The special session on strontium 90 was convened a t 9:OO p.m. on January 16 with Dr. G. Fail la presiding. The following persons were Mr. Hanson Blatz, Scientific Secretary STAFF, DIVISION OF BIOLOGY AND MEDICImE Mrs. Frances Montgomery, Secretary

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DR. FAILLA opened the meeting by presenting the problem. meeting was held in Washington on December 26, 1956 for the purpose of considering the strontium-90 fallout question, but no decisions were reached. DR. GLASS pointed out two things that happened at the meeting which prevented Commissioner Murray that the weapons testing program for the coming year was already decided upon and the comment by Admiral Strauss that there was no great urgency for a statement by the Committee. STATUS OF reaching a decision. They were, the statement by commented that Admiral Strauss had not been aware of the purpose of the apecdal meeting when he arrived to greet the members and had later expressed the opinion that he did not intend to discourage the Connnittee from studying the problem and making any recommendations it saw fit. Dre Fallla said that the problem exists in the mind of the public and that some statement should be made by the AEC as to what is the true eltuation with regard to the strontium-90 hazard. SESSION ON THE STROIJTIUM-90 FALLOUT PROBLEM (Continuation of Discussions at Special Meeting) In response to a question by Dr. Dunham as to whether the Committee had in fact come to any decision, DR. WARREN stated the need for further information as to the degree of accuracy of the various analyses of strontium in the bono. This stimulated a lengthy discussion of the methods of sampling and the analysis and the Committee was reaeaured by DR. DUNHAM and DR. WESTERN that there was very little likelihood that any significant errors involved in the bone analyses which are currently being done by five or eix different laboratories, including one in England. The desirability of offering spiked samples to the various laboratories for intercomparison was discussed and DR. WESTERm agreed to follow thie Merril Eisenbud's estimates of ultimate maximum uptake by a factor o f 2 to 5 in a downward direction. Bo indicated that recent statements by Dr. Comar would tend to alter DR. WESTERN pointed out that these exact numbers are relatively unimportant, but that the entire problem should be redefined in order to clarify understanding In three general classes of the public; the general non-aclentlfic public, the general ecientific public and the scientific public informed with regard to radiation. Such a redefinition of the problem would consider the pertinent criteria; ouch sa, genetic effect, bone cancer, leukemia and lifespan. The queetlons should be considered ae to what is safe and unsafe or what ie acceptable or unacceptable and aleo what would be the alternative to a normally unacceptable level.

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DR, STERNj in response to a request for his opinion by Dr. Failla, stated that it was of great importance to get the general scientific groups to avoid contradictory statements by competent scientists. Dr. Failla pointed out that the more serious matter was the apparent contradictory statements by those associated with the AEC. DRe GLASS raised the question of establishing a policy regarding public statements on this or similar subjects by responsible scientists in official or quasiofficial groups; such as, the AEC, the NAS, the ACBM, etc.. DR. STERN expressed a belief that if the ACBM were to prepare a statement and receive the endorsement of the GAC, it would have a great influence on the scientific community. DR. FAILLA stated that the GAC had asked the ACBM f o r a statement but there had been many delays in attempting to arrive at a decision. DR. CANTRIL stated that perhaps there had already been too great a delay but that the need for a statement of an educational rather than a propoganda DR. F1;TLW raised t h e question of the current state of knowledge regarding tho relative uptake of strontium and calcium. DR. DUNHAM and DR. WESTERN . reported that considerable work wa6 being done in this area and that important additional work I s being planned. Indications are that there is preferential discrimination of from 2:l to 5:1 in favor of calcium. DR. FAILLA and DR. GLASS both expressed concern for the use of absolute numbers in stating the part of the population affected by radiation, DR. FAULA expressed belief: that there are no thresholds of various radiation effects; such as, bone tumor, leukemia or life shortening, but this cannot be proved. The question then appears to be what percentage of the population can we tolerate to be damaged. The Geneticists have stated that 10 r In thirty years is acceptable. the spontaneous mutation rate is 50 r up to age 30, this means that an increase of 20$ in the mutation rate is acceptable. likely that a 2 6 increase in bone tumor incidence would also be acceptable, considering that the spontaneous incidence of bone tumors le small. also pointed out that we should not ignore the fact that we a r e distributing strontium on countries other than OUT own. If the gonadal dose of radiation requlred to double On this basis it is At the request of Dr. Failla, DR. WESTERN proposed the following action. The ACBM should suggest to the AEC that steps be taken to Inform the public with regard to the strontium-90 hazard from weapons testing. Such a program would probably take a year o r two and might result in a number of publications directed 8% the non-technical public, the sclentiflc public and the segment of the scientific public informed on radiation, such as radiologists. DR. CANTRIL suggested an AEC report (not a book) which would state what is known to date,

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could be done to learn more, but that no conclusions opinion that the ACBM should report only to the AEC with no recommendation regarding a public statement and that the statement should perhaps be made by groups, such as t ACTION (in the form of numbers) should be drawn. It was DR. GLASS' DR. WARREN suggested a further look at tangible things, such as the results of experimentation with mice and dogs and also a careful review of what is known about man, for example, his tolerence to radium. He expressed the opinion that predictions were too far from the tangible. A lengthy discussion followed regarding the effects of radium on humans, both from the carcinogenic as well as the genetic point of view. The contento of the latest semi-annual report as well as further progresa by IUS Committees were discussed. DR. CANTRIL suggested keeping in todch with NAS Committee progress before writing any report and that a correlation in point of view and in number would be desirable before making any quotations to the psesaa. DR. DUNHAM aaked the Committee if ang members f e l t that the situation Vas enough facts at hand t o reach a decision. A discussion SB t o what should be considered dangerous followed with suggested estimates of allowable percentage increases of bone tumors and lung cancer. t6e opinion that the immediate concern of the ACBM is whether gation is being carried out adequately and b), that uninterpreted data be presented to the scientific community. interpret the data and that the NAS should be asked if the investigation about the desirability of challenging public statements of colleagues and the dangers of over-emphasia in statements by recognized scientists. DR. GLASS responded that it may be but that there were not He believed that the NAS should A discussion followed between DR. GLASS and DR. WARREN The meeting was addonned at approximately ll:3O pornon

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The session was caXBed to order at bX:40 a.mo with all the ACBM members (except Dr. Bugher and Dr. Burnett) presmt in additicn to Dro Bunham, Ws. Montgomery (part time) and Mro Blatz. February 1, 1957. DR. WARREN proposed a motion as follows: "The Advisory Committee wishes to express its appreciation to fulfillment of many years of loyal and affectionate service as Secretary to the Committee, The members alpe certain that they speak also for all MRS. MONTGOMERY'S & s o Frances R. Montgomery upon the DR. CAI?TRIL seconded the motion and it was carried unanimously. need for selecting nominees to present %os appointment. He also pointed out that Dr. Failla would be retiring from the Committee soon and that a replacement for him would be needed as we19 as the selection of a new Chairman. A list of possible candidates for Dr. Fred's replacement had been discussion of the type of scientist needed. DR. FAILLA indicated a preference for a biochemist. RESIGNATION prepared by Stackman and these was a considerable a person with biochemical and agricultural interests, if posssible and DRo GLASS suggested a micro-biologist. DR. FAILLA suggested that particular emphasis on agriculture did not appear to be necessary, but DR. DUNHAM pointed out the great number of agricultural contractusal matters coming upo of fallout had many agricultural implications and thet there was conbiderahle congressional interest in sgsicultuse. DR, WARREN pofnted out that the problem DR. WARREN suggested that ssrangements be made fos the ACBM to call on DR, FAILLA as a consubtan+,sfter the expiration of his term of office and wait a year OF so before selecting a radiation-physicist Cdt tee member. It was finally decided to nominate the following cagdfdates for submission to the General Manager: Ds. Paul Fe Sharp; Dro-J. b o Horsfall and Dr. Sharp being the first choice.

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DR, DUNHAM reported that a letter was being prepared in which the principal d$ffciencies of the ABCC were enumerated; housing, the ICA hospital wing, a permanent NAS offices and field scientific director. Dr. Keith Cannan w i l l continue as executive officer and be in Japan for about three monthso Dr. Holmes is to ABCC return soon. The recent recruitment program has been good and it is expected that a pathologist will be obtained soon. DR. GLASS pointed out the desirability of continuing the genetics program with the AEC having an adviser for the ABCC. suggested after considerable deliberation, Dr. James F. Crow of Wisconsin. He proposed that Dr. Crow go to Japan for some months and indicated that Dr. Crow would be willing to do so. look at the program to date would suggest what to do next, but that the major program should be left to the Japanese. holding up any policy action on the matter until Dr. Bugher and Dr. Burnett were present and suggested placing the item on the agenda for the next DR. FAILLA reported that there have been many complaints about isotope services to foreign countries and proposed including some mention of the fact in the next letter to the Chairmano DR, FAILLA a l s o pointed out that the old Weapons Test Feasibility Committee was no longer active. He believed that a new look was needed, and It was believed that a quick The military and the AEC decide about that Fresident Eisenhower appoint a committee to advise about these tests. DR. GLASS expressed the opinion that Perhaps it would be advisable to suggest WEAPONS this was somewhat similar to policy matters on the TEST location of nuclear reactors. It was generally agreed POLICY that no proposal should be made until an informal approach had been made by Dr. Dunham. It was agreed that the next meeting was to be held in Washington on March 8 and 9 or on March 15 and 16, 1957, depending on other commitments of the Committee, meeting would probably be held i n Rochester. It was generally agreed that the May DR. FAILLA suggested that Dr. Western's writeup of the material on the strontium-90 fallout problem be used as a basis for preparing an ACBM report to the Commission. The Executive Meeting was adjourned for lunch at about l2:3O p.m..

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BIOLOGY AND MEDICINE PROGRAM SESSION - JANUUY 19, 1957 This session convened at 2:OO p.m. with the following persons present in addition to those present at the Executive Session: STAFF, DIVISION OF BIOLOGY AND MEZIICINE Dre John 8 . Wolfe Dro Herbert A. Stanwood STAFF, RADIOLOGICAL LABORATORY UNIVERSITY OF CALIFORNIA MEDICAL CENTER DR. WESTERN presented an extensive discussion of the various factors which might be used in determining the potential hazard from fallout. He traced the arario- factors affecting the eventual deposition of strontium 90; including, end stratospheric fallout, radioactive material on plants as well as uptake through the soil, radioactive material in food products and the included consideration of Cs-137, Ce-144, rare earths and plutonium although at present strontium 90 appears to be the only material of concern. FALLOUT amount appearing in human bodies. In this discussion he DR. TOTTER presented the plans for the symposium to be held at Brookhaven this Spring. It is expected that foreign representatives from Central half of these would be in the field of biology and INTER- medicine. The invitation to attend and present talks AMERICAN presented a delicate matter of diplomatic and scientific

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DR, DUNHAM reviewed the history which lead up to the proposal received from myU to embrace the NYO Health and Safety Laboratory as a contract advantages and disadvantages of such a change, it was decided that it was not yet t h e to give up the only expected that the laboratory will move to space on the University campus which the AEC Kfll rento aspects of this decision were discussed; including, the relationship between the Inspection Division and DBM fhctions, the advantages of a university atmosphere After serious considerations of the various NYU-HASL laboratory operated directly by the AEX. It is now and the budgetary considerations of such a change including relative cost no,,constructfonhas been provided for. DR. DUNHAM reported a better position than in 19!j7, although monitoring, strontium analysis and oceanographic studies in marine biology. $1/2 million has been allotted for a civil-effects program in connection Kfth weapons tests. There has been no allowance for major outside expansion, that there had been no allowance for wage increases for contractor personnel, although such increases were being Important items include; stratospheric ACTIVITIES except the BNL medical facility. MR, STANWOOD stated A number of 1959 budgetary forecasts were made The twenty-first Semi-Annual Report This includes a substantial section on relate …