Document text
Machine-read from the scan, so expect some errors. Lines that couldn’t be read are left out.
Page 4
The FortiethMeeting of the General order at 9:36 a.m. by the Chairman. The to be presentat this Meeting. Secretaryin the absence'of Dr. Dodson, and Mrr Tomei webs also present :._ Sk-m the Minutes of the next previousmebttig had been approved1 Hinutee, the.indiddual membersof the Coimnitteeprior to this Meeting,they wer The Minutes were distributedto the USUE Agenda there followeda generaldiscussionof the weapons problemswhich *re brought aboutby the advent of large weapons. It was agreedthat the Committee'shouldthoroughlyair the entire Weapons field, includingthe proposed reductionin researchfunds by the House had been opposedby t Senate and that for about June a conference to resolve the disagreementhas scheduled. “,_ 7; all members expressedthe hope that the Senate \iew The members of the Co&ttee then made plans for Subcommitteemeet 5_$ti as follows: Reactor Subcommitteeat Argonne on July 7, 8, and 9; k'eapc Keet- Suhozanitteeat Sandia and Los Alamos on July 12, 13, .md ll$,1954. tigs The value of axardswas discussed,and it was agreed that the Cozzittee should inquirefurther into the status of the proposed Presidentialcitationfor the Los Alamos ScientificLaboratory.
Page 5
A short discussionon the Co&itteele recommend.ationof the last Nlchoisjoined the heeting, and members of the Committee. He asked Mr. Nichold tb-expi& the items or Manager which the Commissi& would like to‘have the advice of the General. Dr. wuuld be leavingthe commissionin early summer; concerning‘theparticipationof alien scientistsin the resean of the Coolmissionwas held. Dr. Rabi suggestedthat inquirybc to its grtatue. Mr. Nichols describedDr. Luke as a man with ManhattanEn&.neer Distric experienceunder Dr. Ruhoff, and with-someexperiencewith the Standard Oil company. Mr.*mNicholasaid that Syracuse would give Dr.‘Luke a oneyear leave of absence. Dr. Rabi asked whether this position did not call for long experience in handlinginformationproblems. Both Dr.'Smyth and Mr. Nichols agreed, but told of their difficultiesin finding the proper man. F-isY_ of the Officeof Classificationfor the job. ~0% A"nCHllT=' Mr. Whitman and Mr. Murphree said they knew Dr. Luke, and that ha b&d many of the right qualitiesfor the job. .
Page 6
: Originally,he said, the MTA was thought of as an alter tive to the ore supply. Now the ore supply ie more certain. Dr. Rabi pointed out that MTA also had two other purposeiw+n. originallyplanrae n&ely, the productionof polonium substitutesand ihe productionof; tritium. It was agreed that the criticalrequirementsfor both these the Fiscal Year l&j Program for MTA beforelit soon;~~&that he was seeking guidanbeis to the appropriatefundinglevel for this activity.. Dr. Sxx@h restatedthe questionas, should we put the results, as they now s&d, on the'.helf;or should we spend another 34 million dollare or so to operatetha new machine and then put it on the shelf? Mr. Hum& thought it a mistake to keep putting off the decision a to what to do with the MTA. 4ie said that unless &. are'goingto build productionmachine we probably ought to stop,'butthat the 6AC could plllned the Commissionrsproposedplan to segregateinformationof lcw security significancebut of value countries. Dr. Rabi inquiredinto to industry and friendlyforeign Mr. Nichols discussedthe status of the Materials TestingAcceleri three items which he thoughtbore on this informationproblem: (1) denial to the Russians; (2) preventionof competitornations obtaini-.g a position adverseto ours; and, (3) securing an advantageto the Uni$ec States by trading. I
Page 7
Dr. Rabi said that the CAC had recommended~thefame eort of thing previously,and that th'egwould be glad to hear more &boa& it from the At'this time,Dr. Rabi inquiredif anythinghad bee; done on the Policy question.ofthe participationof alien scienhste &I the research progr and that he did not know its present status.* .. course of nuclear fissionor nuclear-transformation",He wndered if There was no discussionon this point. Do8 AP.~N~~~~ article on thermonuclearmatters as serious..Dr. S&h said that the timing and manner of expressionindicateda leak. He said that en inwzstigationhas being made to find out how Time ,maga&e had found auf
Page 8
In responseto Mr. Whitman'squestionas to what was the Commissio: Aircraft problem on the AIJPprogram, Mr.’ Nichols said that the’ Reactor Subcodt Prop& of ,the’ joint Congreseional Committee on Atomic Erfekgy had recommended t: Program the ANP program be accelerated. He explained the new c&is6 concept involving the design of aircraftoperating ‘onchar&l fuel for takeoff and landing, on nuclear fuel for unlimited crui6e; and on both chemical and nuclear fuel for apr&a at Kaoh 2 over targe% said, tend6 to look on this aa &J&g them indep&&‘of overseas baset The proposed extra effort during Fiscal Year 1955 a&z&s to’ about. . Dr. Rabi remtiked that such use would require’large amounts of fi’s-‘. sionable materials, and”Inquired whether there was a firm military Force was finning up a requi&ment, but that the .Natio&l Security’ Count would have the problem. ’ Mr. $uckert noted that the‘ report of the Boeing Aircraft Company was highly favorable. . Mr.’Whitman noted that heavy‘wster was now priced Price He wondered whether the Commission could sell heavy water at a lower pri Kater when production needs had been net, &d &en industrialreactors came 5.n being. Dr. S&h pointed out that there would &me deuterium. Mr. Nichols remarked that the being amortizedover a long time. He told the sion was still studyingthis problen,but that if he xsre in the infl.xtr reactor businesshe wuld consider heavy water to be in the be a continuingneed for Ccmittek that the Cozz3.z
Page 9
-x Dr. von Neumcvrninquired into the present policies on UtNum4. Lithium Ma. Nichols said that the Commission would build the third plant at OaJ Ridge, and that even so the Cormission will stk faii to meet the rnilitar~ requirements. He said that it wwld be 1957 before wa could 1,^ . over t&normal Uthium, yd that even then for fOl a weapon we could-& yield if we used l+@ Uthium-6 r ther thar normal material. He advised the Committee that fok the 5 and a yield of The afternoon session was called to order at 1:jO’p.m. bi’ths Dr.. Johnson reported that the Senate. &i t&en action to restore Research the budget cut of the research program which had been made by the House Eudget This met Cxce s- Chief of with the approval of those present. _ Johnson announced the resignation of Mr. the Metallurgy Branch of the Division..df Mb. tioned briefly his recruitment plans, and asked for suggestions fro=. would be good sources of information, end Dr. Wigner suggested ttit Dr.
Page 10
._ -_ _ further that a man be obtainedwith about the same Mr. Lillie had five years ago, when he came to the Dr. Johnson said that he had Tuttle to report Con- .’ a ht this time, but that he would give the GAd a report at its next I&. Wigner said that he had not; about hid projedt becausehe underIn responseto a question, Program tdlke+ with w at Princeton stood that he was not cleared for this subject. It w& pointedout to . result of a misunderetanding,for his positionon the Gk requiredthat he have access to.‘everything.Dr. Johnson said that he was sure that there was no diffictlltyin this regard, and that if necessaryhe would the Division of Researchnotifiedthe project leaders in writing.) a study leading toward the c&struction of a the Midwest. Dr. Zinn plans to divert-'about five people from their others from the participati present assignmentsand to employ about five universitiesof the Midhest for this study. there were any plans for an acceleratorat Oak Ridge. He has told that they are consideringthe subject,but have not progressedas far in thei plans as have the Argonnepeople. He agreed that there was an urgant reason for ellowingA?& to go ahead with their plan, but expressedt% hope that somethingcould be done for ORXL later. _,_,,. ..-:,-~-..:T;~s Dr. Johnson reportedthat there were no problems on the pricing of radioactive and stableisotopeswhich needed Cozmitteeattention.
Page 11
After a short discussionon computers,theiChairmansuggestedtha domputereit was the co&nsus of tke Cormnitteethat the ResearchDivisionshoti, give sympatheticconsiderationto proposals_f;bmu&vereities involvin &c procurementof conputersfor work on Atomic Energy Commissioa appeared in the'RedStar, an officialRed Army publication. He remarkr that althoughthe Red Star is generallyavailableto the RussianpubUc these articleswere preparedby military people. _Thosepresent remarks on the naivety of the Red Starts sketch of the H-bomb: received to the effectthat Dr. Reichardtannouncedthat the Eethe panel would be convenedin July or August to go over the USSR tests. In answer to a question,he stated that no furtherUSSR tests had been detected. .
Page 12
Mri Strauas reviewedthe statue of the Presidentleproposalfor an internationalscientificconferenceon the peacefuluses of atomic Scientl-energy,-ahd fumlehed the Committeewith copies of the State Department ference proposal.tothe Russians on the pool of fissionablematerials (ARC 2261.. He mentioned that he had asked Dr. Rabi to functionas the chief prel&nine orgdnizerfor the internationalconference,and that he hoped steps, and anythingeise which-would place of meeting,.tikng, procedur and hydrogen weqpxis, He asked_ the GAC to considerwhat the advantage8 help make the conferencesuccesefu and ssadvantages w&d-be to a Mr. Nichols remarked,&& it wuld become difficultfor the ARC to get funds from the 'Congressfor weapons tests if there.wzre any indication".,-...." that the Nehru proposalis tobe a&egtsd. He-stated as an example thai he xas worried about the proposed3,ocK)pound thermonuclearwarhead and believed that it shouldbe tested at the appropriatetime. Dr. Rabi agreedthat the Committeewould advise the Cotission on Dr. Beckerleyenteredthe meting at 3:x) p.m. for his talk on ihss Dr. Beckerleypresentedthe GAC with copies of the various tiicle: tions which had appearedin the prejs since certain deletions had been r=3de
Page 13
from the Alsop H-bomb article submittedSeptember18, 1953. It was hii belief that most of the speculationsgrew‘fromthi deletionsin the Al: He concludedby saying that his resignation'wasfor personal reas and did not follow from internalAEC strife as-somepress storieshad Gen, Keirn pointed_'upthe importancewhich the Air Force puts on Program continentalbases. He said that it now ,,,ar~d-that:'one~.cbuldho this Col. K-&berg then gave a vsry dle& prese&%.o~ of the possibili ties of combiningnuclear and chemical fuels &o a singlepower plant. He describeda liquidmetal &bojet'&i&' designedto'be powered by nuclear fuel alone,by cheticalfuel al&e, dr by both nuclear and He illwkkated the concept of nuclear c&i&' as follows: take-of: and climb to 3'5,000feet pn chemical fuel alone, m&ted cruise on nudlea; fiel at aboutI!adh,9 titil near the target, c35iIbto 50,039 feet and sprint over targei &is up io 630 n&tical miles at Xach 2 on both nuclear and chemicalfuel, descend to 35,000 feei ko$ x&u-a cmts on nuclear fuel and land on chemical fuel alone. ._
Page 14
Col, Krisbergpointedout that (1) the performance,both augmented and emergency,of such a plane 3.6set by the chemicalfuel end that adequate cruisingperformanceoould be obtainedwith a 156-megawatt ar& within the ran& of known reactor design; (3) the controls are simp and, (&the shieldweightsare of the order of only 60,000 to 70,000- . He also noted that operationaldifficultiestiererediced over thosl which would be encounteredwith completelynuclear. fueled aircraft. He said that the take-offand landing on'chemicalfue.i-alonemeant that (1) there would be no ex~o5ure of base personnel to'*nuclearradiation3 -which he said would wigh about 290,OOGJpounds and &ch could operate as describedwith a megamtt reactor snd chedcal fuel. Mr. Whitman asked what would be the chemical contributionto thrust during the sprint when both nuclear and chemical fuel were used. Col. Gen. Keirn, in responseto Mr. Xurphree's question as to which type of reactor was consideredbest, stated that he thought that both the General Electricheterogeneousreactor and the O?XL-Pratt& Nhitneg "fireball"reactorkould work. He thought that we should go ahead with,
Page 15
the reactorexperiments to see what Krisberg mentioned that the Nuclear Dr. Rabi asked about their perfonasnc,sd are. Col, Dovelopnent Associates was studyin, steel heterogeneous reactor which might bs work on the super&itical water reactor had; Neumann left the meet&i in which these redo$ could be used. Cen. Keirn said that the time scale will ‘prbbably follow the usual pattern.~ The Air Force has two ox. thx%s study contrects at about the $400,000 level nowa:but the early_* sixties seemed to be the best answsr. Col. Krisberg said that Boeing.,,. . . -. and Convair have looked-’ over the field, and made prel&&ry design. ensued a general discussion of the proposed budget for these for Pratt & Whitney for the fluid fuel reactor for fiscal for the General Elect& heterogeneous Cen. Keim had rezsrked that the year 1954 for the fluid fuel reactor reactor studies seemed proper, $5,OCO,#C increase over fiscal &s all that they could do for the first year even on a crash basis.. :-. .,_‘:_' Mr. Whitman then inquired’if the AEX progreni-was tailored to a specific proposal or if it wem flexible enough so that the reactor could be used for missiles, if that were desirable. Col. I!assell st:tC thzt the initial reactor experiments wuld occuFp the next tws pars an at that tin;t xe would have to decide on the end use.
Page 16
I fuels reactor, and about l!S5 ‘pounds were required for the G& Fuel fabrication, and inquired, if there here any suggestions on h& dch Fabrica- costs could be reduced. ‘.. h&es&n ihat reactors should be designed for a mM@n’amo& of cheaper structural materials even though they absorbed neutrons, and greater tolerances on design. Mr. Davis next discussed the problem of .distributing reactor technology information to industry and to .friendIiy for&n countries. He OS- said that they were convinced that the bulk of reactor technology infcrr c:_on tion could be placed in an area which would not require full backgrc-.zd invzstigation of all persons having access to it. The Cdttee ~a9 in
Page 17
agreement with these viewsi and expressed the hope that the propoeed revisions of the AtomicEnergy: Act would permit -the establlehment of. . such a ((grey’t area of informatiok Mr. D&e reviewed the tech&al akomplishmenta of the HTA projec date. ’He said that this program has demonstrated that (1) a vacuum the-order of 1 x 10. 6 mmof mercury could be obtained in large Program bavlties with mercury pumps; (2) ion sources could be produced to give &h an effk.$ency of 35%; (3) cavity excitation in such_ a machine coult produce 100 milliampere currents at 12 Xev for 20 hours; and, (4) spark and focussingproblemscan be s,dlved. He said that high energy physics studies have shown that-the nu&ber of neutrona per incident deuteron at Mev is from 4 to 11, and that with !%I0 M& -ks’ might get ‘25 neutrons No target is in. hand, but there does not appear’ to be- any concern.,.;*..., about the feasibilityof a suitablet&get. Mr. Davis went on to say that it was planned to start up the low energy end of the SO-megacycleacceleratorin October, Dr. Rabi inquiredif there wxe any producticnor reactordevelopment interest in continuing these studies. Mr. Da?& said that there wThe members agreedthat any further interest h these studiesL&S in the research field, and thereforeexpressed doubts as to the wisdom of further expendituresfor the project. At 6i35 p.m. this Session has adjourned.
Page 18
The Chairmancalledthe mfeetingto order at 9:30 kn. All members 1. It was generallyagreed that there did'not seem to be any Productii Materials Division or ReactorDeveloIxnentDivision inte&st k MTA: s AceelF members thought that this project did not warr$t &port by the the Committeeshould-requesta.comprehensi&'paperon ANP for. members agreed to reaffirmtheir 'suppcktkor the establishment of seminatedto certainclassesof inditidualswithout the requirementfor tion full backgroundinvestigation. . The consensusof the Committeehas that the reductionof fuel Fuel Element fabrication costs was higky desirable, Mr. Hurphree felt that to endorseit, but wished to suggest that certain c&422
Page 19
The Nehru proposal to …
The text continues in the original scan (39 pages).